Chuckie - Ucf sanctions

**Cribby** · 07-31-2012, 11:05 AM

C Robinson has been talking about how bad Ucf's program would get drilled, even saying early today " it won't be pleasant" . Well if getting "drilled " is a one year postseason ban in football and basketball, I can only hope we get drilled too.

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**Cribby** · 07-31-2012, 11:09 AM

Oh yeah, five football schollies over 3 years.

**Ed La Fave** · 07-31-2012, 11:28 AM

They handed out some fairly serious show clauses which was nice to see. I do believe the NCAA is starting to shift more towards punishing individuals which is nice.

...they phrase the scholarship losses so strangely. It seems like they lost 15 scholarships over the course of 3 years, is that right? We could get nailed on that front because our allegations are way more severe.

**Cribby** · 07-31-2012, 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by Ed La Fave

They handed out some fairly serious show clauses which was nice to see. I do believe the NCAA is starting to shift more towards punishing individuals which is nice.

...they phrase the scholarship losses so strangely. It seems like they lost 15 scholarships over the course of 3 years, is that right? We could get nailed on that front because our allegations are way more severe.

Yes it's fifteen total. The AD and coaches were involved with a sports agency, paying tuition , travel and god knows what else. The Ad actually told the NCAA he didn't know all the rules lol.

There was lots of show clauses. Like I mentioned last week Emmert wants to punish the guilty parties more and the schools a little less.

**Cribby** · 07-31-2012, 12:12 PM

Ucf football program was already on probation when the investigation started, that didn't help.

**DapperSlapper** · 07-31-2012, 02:42 PM

Originally Posted by Ed La Fave

They handed out some fairly serious show clauses which was nice to see. I do believe the NCAA is starting to shift more towards punishing individuals which is nice.

...they phrase the scholarship losses so strangely. It seems like they lost 15 scholarships over the course of 3 years, is that right? We could get nailed on that front because our allegations are way more severe.

Unless you've seen a NOA that no one else has seen, how do you know our allegations are more severe? The NCAA punishes based on allegations that are proven - at this point, we don't even know what the allegations are.

**Ed La Fave** · 07-31-2012, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by DapperSlapper

Unless you've seen a NOA that no one else has seen, how do you know our allegations are more severe? The NCAA punishes based on allegations that are proven - at this point, we don't even know what the allegations are.

Fans of any team that is about to be punished by the NCAA love to play the denial game, so I'm not mad at you for doing it. USC fans did it, UNC fans did it, and now Miami fans are doing it.

The allegations I'm referring to are from the Yahoo report and yes it is 100% accurate/valid/correct to refer to them as allegations. It is also perfectly reasonable to assume there was far more truth than lies in the Yahoo report because with the exception of 1 player EVERY current player named in the report was found to have broken rules as was subsequently kicked off the team, suspended, or fined. Who can forget those Tyrone Moss interviews...anybody really believe he didn't take cash?

Canes fans, take your heads out of the sand! We broke the rules...in multiple sports...for a decade...with multiple coaching staffs! Charles Robinson is reporting more truths than lies. Miami will be punished, the severity is the only unknown at this point.

**theschnauzers** · 07-31-2012, 03:35 PM

Ed, you are forgetting that even with then-current players, the degree of involvement with Shapiro was exaggerated in Robinson's reporting. and his Shapiro's claims.

Robinson engaged in a form of yellow journalism, and that's about the only thing we can be sure of at the moment.

**DapperSlapper** · 07-31-2012, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Ed La Fave

Fans of any team that is about to be punished by the NCAA love to play the denial game, so I'm not mad at you for doing it. USC fans did it, UNC fans did it, and now Miami fans are doing it.

The allegations I'm referring to are from the Yahoo report and yes it is 100% accurate/valid/correct to refer to them as allegations. It is also perfectly reasonable to assume there was far more truth than lies in the Yahoo report because with the exception of 1 player EVERY current player named in the report was found to have broken rules as was subsequently kicked off the team, suspended, or fined. Who can forget those Tyrone Moss interviews...anybody really believe he didn't take cash?

Canes fans, take your heads out of the sand! We broke the rules...in multiple sports...for a decade...with multiple coaching staffs! Charles Robinson is reporting more truths than lies. Miami will be punished, the severity is the only unknown at this point.

UCF was punished for what was either proven or admitted to. Neither you nor anyone who posts here has any idea of the sum of all violations at Miami. What the then current players were punished for last year was a fraction of what was alleged in the Yahoo story. Your prior posts equate what Yahoo alleged against Miami with what UCF was punished for - that's not a valid analogy. I keep a level head about these things because (a) I'm a practicing attorney, and (b) I've worked on NCAA issues before. I know how these things work - maybe the NCAA is able to prove quite a bit, maybe they're not... It seems like a long shot for them to prove a lot of it though.

Whether there's more truth than not in the Yahoo story is not relevant. The statement above the judge in court that says "We who labor here seek only truth" is false in court, and it is even more false in most administrative settings - thankfully false for those of us who practice criminal defense.

Regarding Moss, if he didn't speak to the NCAA, then nothing comes of it - what he allegedly told Yahoo is irrelevant unless the NCAA gets that information for themselves. The NCAA has to get their own info - no relying on what others have reported or what unnamed sources told anyone else. Don't tell me about the Freeh report either, because that was an exceptional situation that required unprecedented action by the NCAA (and I don't mean the punishment - I mean the procedures that were used to give Emmert authority to take action).

**Ed La Fave** · 07-31-2012, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by theschnauzers

Ed, you are forgetting that even with then-current players, the degree of involvement with Shapiro was exaggerated in Robinson's reporting. and his Shapiro's claims.

I disagree with that assessment, strongly. I thought the punishments the NCAA handed out fit the allegations pretty nicely. When it gave UM a recruiting advantage (Vernon, Dye, etc) you had 4+ game suspensions, when kids took a couple hundred bucks from pool tournaments you had 1 game suspensions, and when kids were alleged to have taken trivial amounts of money they had to pay it back. The punishments were almost exactly what I expected.